Eugene Costa wrote:
> The mechanics are really simple--one will not get from point A to point B in regard to the collapse or the currency and the economy without nationalizing oil first.
>
Oil is a tool, just like gold has always been, to manipulate the masses.
Do some digging of your own as to how the oil monopoly (primarily
Anglo-Saxon) got in bed with the banking elite in order to create the
Petro dollar. You can start with Century of War by F. William Engdahl.
> I am not interested in arguing the point or making a case. It is too late for that.
>
> If you and others cannot see the simple mechanics there is no point in talking about it.
>
May I submit it is you who do not understand the mechanics?
> It will all wash out soon enough.
>
> The US right now is not in the position of creating any new currency--period.
>
> Most simply do not realize how bad things are.
>
OH contraire. Many do, including myself!
> As far as your theories are concerned, there is no question thatUS debt-credit is a disaster that sends money to the top, both privately and through the Federal government, as Kucinich says.
>
> That is exactly what it is intended to do, and has been intended to do from the beginning.
>
> Yes, currency should be debt-free, but there are many different ways to manage that.
>
> As it stands you and most of the economists and money theorists are missing a central point.
>
> No matter what the monetarists say (they are agents of the system and say what they are paid to say, consciously or unconsciously) debt-credit quasi-currency is not a commodity, and that is not, as you hold, what the system "allows".
>
The monetarists that I follow are NOT agents of the system - nor are
they paid a single red cent for what they do. In fact, many have been
persecuted or worse. Byron Dale for example was beaten to a pulp and had
his ranch confiscated for his efforts.
As to money being a commodity, even Aristotle himself described it as
such - when money is allowed "to make a gain of itself"
> The collapse is a clear indication that it is not allowed at all, whatever the clowns say.
>
> It is more complex than that, and things are much worse than you seem to think.
>
I have absolutely NO idea where you come to the conclusion that I do not
understand just how bad things are. Please read carefully my article
"Pulling Ourselves from the Economic Abyss" or read about the first
great global crash of 1345, the after effects of which reverberated
through the REAL economy for 100 years afterwords.
As to being complex, that is only because the system as it operates is
designed to be complex, and economics schools are tools to increase said
complexity.
> I might phrase your blind spot very precisely in a few words or phrases that will never occur to you in a hundred years, but if I did so you would surely tell me, as you have before, I am simply putting what you say in different words.
>
> So why bother?
>
Well, may I submit that kind of attitude is exactly what got us here to
begin with. As to key words etc, what I describe is in fact what never
occurs to most people, including economists (although happily that is
changing at least in some sectors)
the truth is that it is NOT TOO LATE - IF WE GOT THE CONGRESS TO DO ITS
CONSTITUTIONAL DUTY!
> I am not against tthe gist of what you say, and agree with Kucincih, but much of the theory and analysis implied below is egregiously in error, not only historically but economically.
>
I suggest you read some 'alternative history" beginning with books by
Alexander DelMar, and checking the discussion of Franklin, Jefferson and
others on the subject. The analysis is far from being "egregiously in
error".
Regards,
gerip
> All the best.
>
> EAC
>
>
>
> L'observation consiste simplement
> en l'intérêt jubilant montré par l'enfant
> à la vue de sa propre image dans un miroir....
>
>
> --- On Wed, 3/11/09, Geraldine Perry <healthadvantage@comcast.net> wrote:
> From: Geraldine Perry <healthadvantage@comcast.net>
> Subject: [PDI] Dennis Kucinich describes One Simple Reform that will fix the leading cause of world's ills
> To: "Gene Costa" <costaeugene@yahoo.com>
> Date: Wednesday, March 11, 2009, 5:44 PM
>
> LESS than 1 1/2 minutes of your time:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-r_-QRKyu6g
>
> Call/contact your Congress critter today and as often as you can and demand
> that Congress support Dennis Kucinich and do its Constitutional duty to coin
> (create) money and regulate the value thereof.
>
> If you still believe our money and currency should be backed by precious metals
> or that it is the government (and not the banking elite) that is the root of the
> problem - please CAREFULLY watch these three you tube segments, less than 25
> minutes total time to watch all 3 segments, beginning with this one:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9E0UPBtmTb0
>
> Following are some of my additions/reiterations to Dale's presentation to
> help dispel common myths:
>
> 1. The common myth is that debt free Constitutional money leads to mischief -
> when in fact it is debt-based money that has ALWAYS led to mischief and much
> worse. This is true whether metals or paper are used as money. When money is
> created as debt, be it paper, or metal, it is treated as a commodity which
> allows those in control to obtain monopoly power over it, and government is
> turned into the servant of the money power/monopoly (as Jefferson foretold).
> This is why one of the Rothschild's said "I care not what puppet is
> placed on the throne of England to rule the Empire, the man that controls
> Britain's money supply controls the British Empire.And I control the money
> supply." This has been going on for 1000s of years!
>
> 2. Today, we have to keep reminding ourselves that although currency is printed
> at the Bureau of Engraving, this is only a TINY fraction of the money supply -
> and it is ONLY printed AFTER the government has in effect borrowed more
> "money" from the privately owned banking system. In short - our
> government does NOT create our money - the private banking system does, and the
> banking system is the prime beneficiary - NOT the government! (Hence a
> Rothschild scenario is in operation).
>
> 3. The money creation system I describe in my book and in the slide
> presentation on my website (which is closely aligned with the American Monetary
> Institute, with one important element added, as described in the intro page to
> my slide presentation) minimizes, if not eliminates that kind of "you
> scratch my back" scenario through transparency, extinguishment and in
> response to the demand coming directly from the people's own productive and
> consumptive capacity.
>
> 4. As Byron Dale said - money is a TOOL, nothing more - nothing less. I urge
> you to read carefully my page on What is Money (as well as Quotes on Gold and
> notable quotes pages):
> http://www.thetwofacesofmoney.com/index.php/Site/WhatIsMoney
>
> 5. As to metals having an advantage because they are limited this is the EXACT
> reason why they should NOT be used as money (something argued hard and often by
> Franklin, Jefferson, Lincoln and others). Recall that fractional reserve
> (creating money as debt) was invented at a time when metals were used as money.
>
> 6. We labor under the media-created myth that the government prints money, when
> in fact money is created (mostly as computer digits) when debt is issued.
>
> Consider that today the total outstanding debt (public and private) is FAR
> greater than our money supply. Thus our total debt is $53 trillion and climbing
> rapidly, while out money supply, using the broadest and now unpublished measure
> of M3 is around $14 trillion (give or take a trillion). If you use Fed measures
> of M1 + M2, the money supply is just $7.7 trillion.
>
> HOW can there be too much money in the system??? There is TOO MUCH DEBT --- NOT
> too much money!
>
> As the ending segment of The Money Masters details, this fact has justified the
> plunder of other people's resources all through the ages, and is the reason
> countries around the world are now disintegrating.
>
> It's well past time we stopped this travesty. PLEASE join this crusade, and
> contact your Congress critters now and often on this subject.
>
>
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